Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board Wag Bags and permits

Good hike up and down on Friday; great weather and many thanks to the Inyo National Forest team working on repairing the bridge and trail. Great job, guys!

But I wonder about what the permit process has become. When I picked up my permit Wednesday, the young man at the counter said they no longer issue the tags for each group member (1 of X, 2 of X, etc.). When I asked how the trail "checkers" would know who was a bonafide member of my group, I was told they would check picture ID's. I pointed out that none of the group members' names are given to the FS. At that, he got a blank look, and said that if they have a wag bag, that sort of proves they've got a permit.

As it was, there was no one to check on the trail anywhere, anyway. We hit Lone Pine lake at 5:30, no one. No one at trail camp at 7:45, either.

Given the unused wag bags on the top of bear boxes in the portal campground, this may be an easy way to avoid the lottery and get on the trail. Perhaps a black market for wag bags?

Unfortunately, like so many government agencies and the programs they construct for us, the permit system is quickly becoming completely ineffective.

Here's an idea, though.

How about when the permit is picked up, that every group member is issued a wag bag and their name and group is written on the outside in magic marker? That way, when they decide to leave it on the hill, the FS can issue a littering citation for, say, $500. Since the group member would be the primary responsible party, there would be great incentive for the leader to police his hikers.....

It would be a great revenue raiser. I am still stunned, though, by the morons that do this. Would you crap on your front porch and just leave it there?........

Re: permits. We showed up on Saturday morning and were able to get a permit for Sunday pretty easily. Seemed like many that showed up were able to get permits, and there were even permits remaining for that Saturday.

I recall reading a previous post some time ago that said for every day that is reservable throughout the year, there were only 3 days all of last year that you had the possibility of not obtaining a walk up permit. For every other day, if you showed up to get a leftover permit, you would have received it. This past weekend was great weather and historically one of the highest in demand, and we got a leftover permit. And they are FREE!

I have a crap load of wag bags I'll sell.

Yeah, great weekend - perfect conditions, trail's in great shape. I reserved permits from a cancellation, would never drive that far without one at peak season. Seems like a lot of cancelled trips this year, but it sounds like there's better availability than I realized every year.

The thought of carrying crap around is enough to constipate me, so I have a few wag bag "permits" for sale (and they're UNused).

Saw lots of full wag bags on the side of the trail on the way up, but only a few on the way down. Maybe some people are choosing not to carry their crap to the summit but taking them out on the return. Wonder how many are still in the bushes and under rocks.

Too bad Inyo chose not to upgrade the broken toilets with modern technology, but I digress...they want you to think the technology is not available because even a working toilet still requires difficult maintenance.

Oh, I really like this idea! I know that personal accountability has become a thing of the past but being fined would sure put the boot on the right foot!!

So then people will just crap on the ground and carry the wag bag. Poop police is not the answer, IMHO.

Used????

Just got down from the summit today. There were wag bags left out in the full sun, puffing up, ready to explode. Crazy.

I was there Thursday and there were many laying on the rocks sunning themselves at trail camp. Is this a camping thing and they will take them when they leave?

When I picked up my permit I was told they would be checking for bags on the trail, and it actually happened to us. Still saw a couple loose ones. To whoever left one on a shelf near the JMT junction, you're welcome but please take out your own next time!

they may check to see if you have a bag but they never look in!!!!!!!!

I will start using one when they get the marmots to use them as well

Why can't people have respect for themselves and others that use the Whitney area? I don't like to see or smell other people's shit (even when it is hidden in a wag bag that has been discarded on the trail), and it would never occur to me to subject someone else to mine.

How can packing and removing one's shit be beneath people in the wilderness? We sleep on the ground, we eat with dirty fingernails, and walk in clothes with accumulated trail dust. Just poo in the nice ziploc bag, and take it the heck out. The rest of us will thank you for that small courtesy.

Thanks.

After finishing a three day trip last week, I had a beer or two and watched over 20 back packers decend past me at the start of the trail .
ONE and only ONE person had a full bag of poop and put it in the can
I asked some of the others who had the bags and it was quite apperent that they had not been used, they simply said it was not ever going to happen.
there has to be a better answer than packing your poop for mutiple days

It occurs to me in the discussion that there may be a process occuring that was unintended.

People use there bags somewhere on the way up, either on a one day, or multi day, but do not want to cart it to the top. So they stash it, with the intent of picking it up on the way down.

Others pass by, see it, and think that others have discarded their bag, which is logical.....but which gives a misimpression.

If one were to leave Trail Camp with a used bag, where would one leave it? if not in a bear can, it would likely be torn up by varmints. One wouldn't want that in a tent or pack! One might set it away from the gear, logically, and it would be thought to be discarded.

Now there is a scientific study.

And yet the wag bag containers at the portal are jammed full, suggesting that a lot of folks respect the rules and use them. Recall that most hikers are not overnight hikers, meaning that they probably never took a dump. So you are not going to see full wag bags on every hiker.

Sure, using a wag bag is an inconvenience. So is driving or flying for several hours to climb Mt. Whitney; dealing with exhaustion, pain, whatever while climbing Mt. Whitney; dealing with mosquitos near Outpost Camp; and so on. To only accept the inconveniences that get you want you want (i.e., a summit) seems, well, the heart of selfishness.

Ken,

While I was at Trail Camp this year for three days and two nights, I saw wag bags that were completely abandoned all over the place. If they are there when you arrive, and there when you leave, and no new tents have been erected or taken down during the period, you know they are abandoned.

And it was far worse this year than last. Last year, though, I saw a ranger going through trail Camp looking for, and picking up, used wag bags. He actually asked us to point out ours so that he would know which ones were abandoned. He had a very very big bag.

And then you have the people who do not even use the wag bags ... they just poo and go.

just to clarify I asked the overnight packers- its easy to figure who they are with the sizable back packs, there has to be a better way of dealing with the poo
I refuse to use one until the marrmots use them as well and considering the size of some of them maybe we can train them to carry all the stuff down

Just let me know when you are going up. I will go up after you and port your shit down for you in the interest of the greater good. And stuff it in one of the containers at the portal already crammed with the bags of the large numbers of people who are handling the inconvenience and have chosen to comply.

done for this year, but thanks
if you looked as close as I did you would have seen that the wag bags were empty and the folks camping there said "the can" had not been emptied in some time. I was there on a thursday so who knows

So you dug around in the dumpster examining wag bags to see if they were full or not, but you won't put your own shit in a wag bag and take it off the mountain?

Based on your dumpster investigation, it would appear that other people's shit doesn't bother you too much. So what is up with your own shit that you can't put that in a bag and cart it away?

This thread is now a two-person conversation. If others want to chime in, that's their business, but I think our respective points have been made.