Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board Total Failure

Tif, you think San G is harder? Wouldn't you rather have steeper and shorter rather than longer and meandering?

Yup - quick, steep gain is much more tiring for me, I'd rather have it stretched out at least a bit over a little bit more mileage. (But I also have had 3 operations on my left knee... so that may bias me a bit) =)

Personally I'd rather not have to put my head down and literally work myself up a mountain, compared to being able to look around and enjoy the hike a bit more on a slightly less steep climb.

There's also the added bonus for me of a less steep decline on the way down... but there my knee goes talking again!

My opinion, Whitney is a very consistent, gentle hike that just happens to be long with a ton of elevation. Getting my body to endure 22 miles in a day is much easier when I have a steady pace, and whitney offers a very steady, even pace throughout the entire hike. SG via Vivian Creek (I've not taken any other routes) has a bit more variation. If you've done a whitney day hike, you'll probably remember the two or three very short uphills on your descent...I know I do. And that's because my body has been going at the same exact pace for hours, and then you hit the 40 seconds of uphill and I'm in pain. Not that SG has a ton of this, but it does have more variation in steapness. And as everyone else has stated, attitude and preparation are huge. Not many people hike whitney to prepare for SG, so most will be much more prepared and excited for whitney, and that goes a long way.

I live in San Francisco, and I know when my car gets to the hills, it has to work a lot harder to get to the top of the hill.
Personally, it is a lot easier to hike trails with shallower slope. Business profits, on the other hand, I like steeper slope...

Just my 2 cents...

Interesting perspectives in comparing the two hikes, thanks for the input.

Wow! I've been off line and should have responded sooner. Thank you all for so much for your incite and shared experiences. I already do feel much better hearing how this climb is challenging for others as well at times. We did take the Vivian trail. So from learning from all the comments I think I know what may have been my trouble that day.

The group (all middle aged fathers like myself) went out at a quick pace on the very steep beginning of the hike. Looking back, in most cases I start off at a moderate pace and only start to push when I feel it come to me; so to speak. So going forward I'll make a point to start out slower and give myself more time to get acquainted with the elevation. (Thanks BruceMiller)

We were lucky that day as we had cloud cover on the way down and it was always cool. So the heat was not an issue for us.

Ken- that is very interesting about the "subclinical" illnesses you described. For my confidence going forward I will also blame 50% of my poor results on this theory.

Again, thank you for the detailed and thoughtful comments I really appreciate it very much. I've upgraded my attitude about my Whitney attempt from "I need to get this off the calender" to " It's going to be a long day", and that is good progress! Who knows....maybe with a solid training day or two I can get back to being just slightly over confident- but wiser.

In regards to comparing the two hikes, doesn't Whitney get any bonus points for the fact that much of the hike is above 11,000 feet? For me, my body moves great once I'm below 11,000 feet and once I get above 11,000 feet I slow down considerably and it seems much tougher than hiking below 11,000 feet.

Bingo

Yes, I surely agree with that. I was discussing this with my husband today (contrasting Whitney to San G.)

Both of us have done both hikes many dozens of times since we were both 16. San G. is a walk in the park compared to Whitney for us. It's instructive and interesting to hear divergent perspectives.

And neither hike remotely compared to a Grand Canyon rim to rim to rim, which is 48 miles and has elevations gains of 11,000 feet.

I think those having trouble with San G are people with altitude issues, which is completely understandable.

Don't get down on yourself. Bad days happen and the first one or two are the toughest to deal with because you're confident in your training and condition but "something" just isn't there. It happened to me last May. I had been training really hard for Rainier for about 6 months and went on a training/gear shakedown hike up Baden Powell. Everything felt good but suddenly after about an hour or so the oddest feeling came over me and I just didn't feel like going anymore so I turned around and walked back down and drove home. I was totally depressed about the situation and with only 3 weeks before my climb, also at odds as to my chances on a real mountain. After discussing my dilemma with my wife, she came to the obvious conclusion that I had over trained myself mentally and needed a break. So I did just that and tapered down my cardio work considerably and concentrated more on weight training (which is what I enjoy) and also took an extra day or two off here and there. Well, it worked wonders because I felt great on Rainier and although I didn't summit due to circumstances beyond my control, IMHO the climb was a success because I had such a fantastic and enjoyable time.

Bottomline, take a little time off from the pressure of feeling like you have to perform. Do some activities that are fun and enjoyable that will help get your positive attitude back. My guide on Rainier shared with me some words of wisdom that I believe apply here: "there's no reason to dwell on one bad day when it's just one day in an entire lifetime".

GreeneMachine,

What do you mean by the same pace?
Do you imply the same horizontal speed in miles/hr, the same rate of vertical ascent in feet/hr, the same heart rate in beats/minute or what?

For example my wife tries to keep the same horizontal speed while hiking and I try to keep the same heart rate.
So our perceptions of how tough a hike is may be different.

I find the topic of having a bad day while hiking very interesting. It must happen to all of us and I'll bet long-time hikers will remember bad days from decades back. I've often wondered what causes someone to just have a poor day on the trail, even when the hiker feels fits, happy, healthy and upbeat.

I remember in 2001, I ran a marathon 4 days before doing Whitney and assumed I would have a poor hike and feel a little fatigued. Instead it was a great hike with no issues. I've also had indifferent or unenjoyable hikes when I have felt fantastic before taking the first step on the trail.

Is there no rhyme or reason to why we sometimes have lousy days?

Years ago when I was running (slowly) Marathons I was in better shape and 7lbs lighter. Ran it 50 minutes slower. I'm going to make a point and never take a good day for granted. Yes, interesting topic.

I think what you eat and do the 1 week leading to the hike also dictates how you perform on the trail. From difficulty point of view, I felt the Marion Mountain trail was unpredictable and annoying compared to Vivien Creek trail (Although MMT is shorter and only 4800ft elevation gain).

Boy, I agree about the Marion mountain approach to San Jacinto. "Annoying" is a good word, especially with the perpetually overgrown manzanitas which scratch up the legs and are irritating.

Marion Mtn. doesn't flow well at all. I much prefer the Humber Park approach to SJ.

I probably used the word "pace" incorrectly. This coming from a guy who has never measured heart rate or vertical ascent per hour, etc. What I was implying is that I don't feel a lot variation in the amount of effort being spent while on the whitney trail. The elevation eventually gets my heart pumping faster, but in general, once I get in to a rhythm on whitney, there's really not a whole lot of variation to contend with. Whereas SG via vivian creek will have a bit more variation, and it's the variation that I seem to feel more.