Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board Indian Army Acclimatization Schedule

They have lots of experience with AMS and HAPE hospitalizations at "only" 10,000 ft.
Look how long they recommend for proper, full acclimatization for Whitney-like heights. Harvey


Indian Armed Forces Acclimatization Schedule
Adapted from Deshwal article in Wilderness & Environmental Medicine, 23, 7-10 (2012)

First stage : 6 days, 2,700-3,600m (8,900-11,800 ft)
Days 1-2: rest except short walks about barracks, no climbing.
Days 3-4: walk slowly for 1.5-3km (1-2 miles), avoid steep climbs
Days 5-6: walk up to 5 km (3 miles) and climb slowly up to 300m (1,000ft )

Second stage: 4 days, 3,600-4,500m (11,800 – 14,700ft)
Days 1-2: walk slowly for 1.5-3km (1-2 miles), avoid steep climbs
Days 3 : walk slowly and climb up to 300m (1,000ft)
Days 4 : climb 300m (1,000ft ) with equipment

Third stage: 4 days, > 4,500m (14,700ft)
Days 1-2: walk slowly for 1.5-3km (1-2 miles), avoid steep climbs
Days 3 : walk slowly and climb up to 300m (1,000ft)
Days 4 : climb 300m (1,000ft ) with equipment

Hi Harvey see the problem?? Look at the views, sit back AND WONDER WHAT WILL IT TAKE? Thanks Doug

Doug, I knew you were paying attention

Is anyone else? I am surprised at the absence of comments on this schedule. Tortoise and the hare.

Snails pace, but very safe.


My calculation for having a "comfortable" climb is (SA - 8000)/1000.

Thus, I'll take 10 days for an 18k peak.

Richard, that's a good rule. We did that and a little more on Aconcagua, but the workload and subzero, windy weather beat the two of us up as we carried all of our loads and staged up the mountain grunt-work style. We should have taken another week. The chart dots show nights, the dots under the triangles are 2 nights


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First off, I am not qualified to comment if this acclimatization schedule is too slow, because I have still not figured out what is a good schedule for me, for Whitney (without the aid of Diamox). Indian army, apart from war-time readiness, are the first responders in the event of avalanche or earthquake in high-altitude border areas. Although they employ local laborers, they still may end up carrying very heavy loads at that altitude. So given the drills they are required to perform at high altitude, does it make sense to have a different acclimatization schedule?

To generalize, wouldn't the acclimatization schedule would be different if you are going to hike-in and hike-out, as against being stationed in a high altitude location for extended period of time?

Doesn't answer your question, but it is related to why India and Pakistan have Mountain Troops:

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Pakistan army head calls for peaceful end to India glacier fight where 140 buried in avalanche

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia...fdQT_story.html

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I was trying to find a link to an article I've seen recently regarding the Indian Army fighting at over 16k'.

What is there to say? It's apples and oranges comparing complete acclimitization for an altitude you plan to live and work at for an extended period versus an altitude you intend to visit briefly and then descend. There is no compelling reason for a mountaineer to expend the time and effort to achieve complete acclimitization for a summit elevation.

But it's interesting to see their schedule. Thanks for posting it.

I'd comment that there's still not anywhere near complete acclimatization after 14 days. It's just more likely that they won't experience severe AMS.

Depends on the mountain.
Above, say, 20,000 you need every bit of it. The difficulties from increasing height are impressive there. Richard is correct, based on his (and my) experience and high altitude physiology knowledge that full acclimatization actually takes 6 weeks or more. Fortunately, much
of the benefit occurs in the first half.

Hi Ep has a point ,one can go up and down this bump with little trouble if you do the right training and the hike understanding the few simple things you are forced to follow. 1. Go very slow 2. Drink WATER/ELECTROLYTE at the rate you are using 3.Eat small snacks to replace the loss.4.Carry a very small pack say less than 5 pounds carry .5.Pressure breathing and the rest step using poles. TURN AROUND AT THE FIRST SIGN OF ANY PROBLEM. Never do the overnight hike without staying 3 days . Outpost night one, summit day two, overnight outpost second night the down the third day. This keeps you in the 10,000' range for sleeping and a very short time at high elevation. Thanks Doug

Day hike should be a very easy day around 20+ hours several breaks and a lot of enjoying the area.

Hi Doug, I'm with you all the way except for the 5# pack. My usual mountain pack is about 15#. For MW I could leave behind the first aid stuff I usually carry with the idea I might get hurt somewhere in the mountains that isn't heavily traveled and have to get myself out. I could carry less water and purify more than I usually do but I think a person needs to carry at least a liter(2#) for the the long dry stretch from the last water up and back down to the spring on the switcher (#26?). And you advise people to have clothing layers for all kinds of weather surprises. Unless you spend a fortune on ultra-light gear and have a source for dehydrated water I can't see a 5# pack. Lay some enlightenment on me, please.

Burt, I'll point out that Bob R, one of the most experienced and numerous climbers of this mountain, and long time member of the local SAR group carries about a 6# pack for OVERNITE. (don't think that counts water.

How do you do it? You make choices. You correctly point out that a water filter weighs 2#. You apparently are not willing to consider other methods of water purification...but there are A LOT, that can cut it to less than 1 oz if you are aggressive.

A lot of people start off with a 4# pack, even for a dayhike. But if you are only carrying 5-10#, there is no reason for a pack that weighs more than 1#, and probably significantly less.

There are MANY web resources for ultralight backpacking, as well as books. In my opinion, these things have revolutionized the whole thing.

Bob's nice summary of water is here:
http://www.ridgenet.net/~rockwell/Whitney_water_trail.pdf
at which he says accurately:

"A word about logistics. Water weighs two lbs per quart. Except for 3, each source is well under an hour’s hike from the previous one,
so it makes little sense to carry water between rest breaks. Just plan your stops to coincide with one of the streams, use your canteen
for dipping and sipping, and carry it empty to the next one."

Hi Burt,

Bob Rockwell's updated (5/3/2010) equipment list for his two day Sierra Nevada summer climbs Ultralight Pack can be found here www.ridgenet.net/~rockwell/Climbing/The_Ultralite_Pack.doc
His pack weighs 5 pounds 7 ounces.

After reviewing his paper on the quality of High Sierra water, it is not surpring that the list has no provision for treating water. However, one notes that brandy somehow sneaked onto Bob's equipment list!

Looking forward to being up on the Mountain soon.

Jim F

It's not practical to achieve full acclimitization for the
highest elevation you plan to reach. How would you do it, carry
a hypobaric chamber up the mountain with you? Or would you spend
many days on the actual summit?

It isn't necessary to be fully acclimitized for the summit. You
just need to be acclimitized well enough to get there and back
safely. Full acclimitization (however that is defined) is going
to be for some lower elevation.

The average person who drives up from sea level for a 2-3 day
climb of Whitney is fully acclimitized to what elevation? 4000
feet?

Thanks, I will look at those equipment lists.

My figure of 2# was for a liter of water between the last source, on switcher #26(?) to the summit and back down to the switcher, not for a filter. I carry a steripen, which weighs a few ounces.

On that note, last year I came back from 11 days in the Sierras and a day later had a terrible urinary tract infection. If it was from bad water, and I think it was, the source was either untreated water on the the trail up to Piute Pass from Humphrey Basin (next to last day out) or improperly treated water at Grass Lake (Meysan Lakes trail) (last day out). Of course, I could have picked it up at a restaurant on my drive home. Who knows?

Since it seems you like to argue...

Where in any of this is there a claim of wanting to acclimatize fully for the summit?

Everybody who climbs seriously knows that the name of the game is to acclimatize to the point that your summit attempt will not be jeopardized by IMPROPER acclimatization. I use SA (summit altitude) in the equation because the literature (and I'm not going to cite any of it) says that 1000 feet (300m) per day is a good rule of thumb to use to avoid severe AMS.

This is correct, there is a limit to acclimatization. We know what it is.

It is impossible to acclimatize "fully" for, say, the summits of Everest, or Aconcagua as in the graph I posted above. The most you can "fully" acclimatize to (meaning stay there permanently, assuming you have food, water, shelter) in about 6 weeks is around 17,000 feet- about the height of Everest base camp, not the summit. But even that is tough for a variety of reasons. The highest permanently settled villages are around 14-15,000 ft.

Why? Because above that altitude, whatever gain is obtained with acclimatization is offset by altitude deterioration. That term is used in the high altitude literature. There have been studies like the Silver Hut and others where long stays were tried, but loss of appetite, poor wound healing, loss of muscle mass, and other problems showed the limit.

As we all have stated, you hope to acclimatize enough to get up on whatever peak you choose, then down to thick air. At the highest peaks, where there are stages of camps above 17,000 ft, the problem is the old bathtub filling and draining scenario except it is acclimatization and deterioration that are happening simultaneously.

In addition to the short term (weeks) discussed above, there are some individuals (like Richard P) or perhaps races (like Sherpas) that may have more longterm/inborn/genetic adaptation to high altitude, but this is less well understood, and there is still a limit. The opposite is true, too. There are some animal species (cows) that cannot live very high, but others (llamas and bar-headed geese) who can.

Crossing the Col de Fenestre between Italy and France, 2,474 m./8,115 ft, I looked up and saw grazing cows and cowherds on a ledge above the trail! (The cows were grazing. The cowherds weren't, so far as I could see.)

Well, this is a website devoted to climbing Whitney.
Harvey posted an acclimitization schedule for an elevation similar to Whitney's summit.
Then when I posted that you don't need to acclimitize for a summit elevation,
Harvey responded with "Depends on the mountain".

So it seemed like there was an implied claim.

Was I just looking for an argument?
I thought this was abuse and that was down the hall!