Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board INCIDENT ON WHITNEY

One other thing:

I don't know if Theloneous did this or not but on impromptu bivys it really helps keep your feet warmer if you loosen your boots and jam your feet and legs into your pack as far as they will go. Those disposable mylar emergency bags really help too.

Theloneus,

Thank you very much for sharing your adventure. If you would of had a GPS receiver with "tracback" feature, you could of navigated back to basecamp in low-visibility condition or even at night.

For the backpackers, like my brothers for instance, who don't like to take along their 'heavy' sleeping bags when dayhiking from basecamp, I recommend taking the Extreme ProTech Bag. It's basically a sleeping bag made of multiple layers of Space Blankets. It's superlight, weighing only 12 oz, and "provides almost the same degree of warmth as a large and heavy 3-season sleeping bag". Visit www.mpioutdoors.com/extreme-bag.htm for more details. It's only $8.50 at http://store.botachtactical.com/mpiexproteem.html

From description, it sounds like you were hypothermic enough after your abortive attempt to leave the summit the first afternoon, so that you were befuddled the rest of the time. What comes through is: you sort of cast around rather aimlessly up there until lucky enough to be rescued before you froze to death.It's easy enough to get that way, especially with some anoxia thrown in.
You are lucky to be alive and have undoubtedly learned alot.

Most important of all is: don't try this sort of thing alone!! Remember the young man a year or so back who had to amuputate his own arm? he was hiking in good weather, but would have been fine if he'd had a companion when his arm got pinned by the rock. You just never know and you wanted to do this thing so badly that you went alone, even though you knew it wasn't really a good idea.
Best of luck to you and I hope you'll return to the mountains despite the fingers and toes.

Best;
Adrian

Several posters have brought up the theme about not going out alone. I'm not sure that I agree, particularly when the specific event under discussion fairly clearly has nothing to do with that assertion. There is always a mix of danger/safety when we venture forth, and there is no doubt that the ratio shifts somewhat, sometimes, when we go alone.
There is a calculation of risk, sometimes a good calculation, and sometimes not.
I'm sure that someone could assert, with many thousands of examples, why it is better to have a companion, if driving and getting into an accident.
Who is going to stop driving alone for safety reasons?
Are we more likely to have an auto accident, or a mountaineering accident?

I could as easily make a silly assertion that backcountry travel with companions put one at risk, then every accident that happens involving more than one person, I can use to back up my claim.
Like the guys who had the accidents on Rainier "SEE! Travelling in groups is dangerous! You don't see any of the solo travellers on Rainier getting killed!"
So, I'd be careful of that kind of logic.

Ken, I appreciate you focusing on this aspect because I've been thinking about it as well with regard to this incident. I do think being alone/not alone bears on the outcome of Theloneus' experience. Would he and a hiking partner have made different decisions? Would they have read the weather differently, given the chance to "put their heads together"? Would one have been able to render physical assistance if the other was struggling?

I go back and forth on this, and have broken the "cardinal rule" myself many times. I prefer hiking with someone when I can, but often go alone if plans are set and a buddy isn't available. I personally wouldn't do it in winter conditions because my own experience is lacking in this area. But I presume Theloneus did have more than a little winter experience, and I may have chosen the same course. (I remain impressed with his calmness through this ordeal). On the other hand, even in the summer I have benefitted from a partner turning me around in questionable conditions as we weighed the options together. I also thought of the comparison of driving a car, but that doesn't completely clear it up for me because you'd also have tweak the hypothetical conditions to be similar, i.e. driving alone in stormy weather across a long and isolated stretch, bad road, etc... I continue to read the thoughts posted here with interest, for my own future hiking decisions. Thanks

I've hiked solo and I've hiked with partners - I know from my experience that when I'm alone I'm much more aware of my surroundings, looking and listening for possible dangers, and the weather. I think that's why I like to hike solo - I'm totally in the present.

Reading Theloneus's report won't discourage me from hiking alone, but does reinforce my own guildelines of not going solo in an area I'm not familiar with or in seasonal conditions I know I'm not experienced in (winter mountaineering).

Thanks for posting, that took a lot of guts. I hope you recover quickly.

For those of you that are interested check out the INYO SAR website...

www.inyosar.org

Here is a link to Randy Nixon's write up of the mission...

http://www.mmarray.org/~rick/html/SAR/Missions/2004April04.txt

INYO SAR's phone # is on the website. I would suggest having that number in your cell phone if you are going to go to the trouble of carrying it with you.

Climb Safe!

I was sure someone would take me to task for my point of view on solo hiking/climbing, but the point can often be that people do get into trouble sometimes when through group effort they might do better. This of course doesn't apply if the group consists of people of inconsistent ability and strength. Nevertheless, sometimes you need someone else along to steady that ladder for you!!
I don't want to start a war with anyone over this issue, but I have some background in winter trips with severe weather conditions where having someone to watch your back can be a life saver, in situations where a lost glove, broken zipper, or sprained ankle could be the end for you without someone to help. Helping with morale is another aspect of having a well matched companion. Again, if you're fit and you pick your couch potato friend as your companion, that won't help either.
I'm getting a bit old now and don't do this stuff as much as I did years ago, but I recall a couple times when I helped companions in various ways, not the least of which was to call a halt in sketchy weather when my more gung ho companions wanted to press on. When clouds drop down and wind stirs up loose snow, things can go down hill faster than people who are used to living in the lowlands can anticipate.
a final note on group endeavor. There's a fine short story written by Wallace Stegner called "Genesis" about cowboys on the Canadian High Plains caught in the open by an Autumn blizzard. The protagonist comes to realize that what the crew leader was urging them on in flight from was actually right in amongst them all the while.

.....2cents....Adrian

As for contacting the SAR team, I do not think that the procedure is to try to contact them directly, but through the county Sheriff. I don't think the SAR teams can officially just start rescues, without the Sheriff's office initiating the process. I don't think the SAR phone lines are set up to record, nor manned 24/7. You might get a recording of who to call for that day, or activate a beeper, or something.

perhaps others with more knowledge of the process can say. Inyo SAR webpage does not actually say.

WalterR,
You are a ****ing keyboard warrior. That means that in real life you are probably a ****ing soft spoken douche bag who takes **** left and right, and when you get on the internet, you become a ****ing blow hard who never makes mistakes and knows all the answers. Mind you, giving your opinion of the mistakes others make is fine. But, when you're a rude ****, then it throws off the point of your subject with your moronic drivel. Quoting the 9/11 commission and Clint Eastwood is just plain weak. The guy made a mistake. Your rabid attack on a guy's mistake sound distinctly keyboard warriorish. I don't think Theloneous was hard on Sherrif Nixon, so you don't need to include your lame-ass opinion on whether you think he did a good job. That Darwin Award **** is way out of line. Everything you've written smacks of you being an over cautious little cunt who likes to live life risk-free, but on the edge of risk taking, so you can point your finger at others who crash and burn. But, like I said, you would probably NEVER have the guts to say what you said TO someone's face. **** head. Think before you type such awful cock-stew next time you ****ing pussy.

FF, this is not the place for language like this. Now Doug will have to SHUT DOWN this board for a few days to erase it which means hikers who need this information won't have access! You don't have to be so rabidly filthy. Kids and women access this board. I can't believe some of these words got through!

I agree that both posts are excessive and inflammatory. Perhaps, after cooling down, both folks can now delete their posts, impressing us with their maturity?

I had not specifically commented on the incident, but I wanted to say that I appreciate that it was posted, that shows character that one would expose oneself to the direct personal criticism.
It is always good for all of us to try to learn from others.

While ffejola certainly did not help his or her case by the abundant profanity, I like the energy and willingness to repect Thelonius for his initial decisions regarding this ill fated trip. The book, after all, is call FREEDOM of the Hills.

Thelonius, I read your open post quite a while ago and didn't feel the need to respond as it seemed that you were coming to the right conclusions on your own. We've all make mistakes on trips and the consequences are usually only minor and inconvenient.

Being rescued though, is somewhat akin to an intervention for substance abuse or otherwise poor decision making. In the mountains especially a rescue/intervention can put other people's lives at risk, which impacts MANY people through just the use of resources. And don't forget that rescuers have families too who love and don't deserve to lose them.

If I had to debrief your trip I would first praise you for doing lots of things right...After all you are still here with us! Beyond that I would suggest leaving the GPS behind and focusing on compass and natural navigation until they are second nature. ALWAYS LOOK FOR LANDMARKS ON THE WAY IN...THESE ARE THE ONLY 'WAYPOINTS' YOU NEED!

Also, and this is something I am working on myself: SNOWSKILLS. There is alot more to winter travel than crampons and snowshoes. Especially when traversing (like the entire upper Main Trail on Whitney) it is good to have an understanding of slope anchors and avalanche triggers. Since you were solo, forget about being dug out and leave the transceiver at home...Another risk to accept.

We could come up with more stuff, good and bad and over a beer but now that you are on the mend it is probably better to start concentrating on the things you will be doing RIGHT on your next trip to the mountains. I'd be happy to go with you when you are ready and if you are interested in a partner.

Take care and thanks again for allowing us to learn from your experience.

>>>>>WalterR,
>>>>>You are a ****ing keyboard warrior. That means that in real life you are probably a ****ing soft spoken douche bag who takes **** left and right, and when you get on the internet, you become a ****ing blow hard who never makes mistakes and knows all the answers.

Wrong, in real life this guy is a very experienced SAR volunteer. You may not agree with the post and you may find it rude and aggravating but in my opinion many, many SAR people would be pretty much in agreement with the sentiment of his post even if most would be too polite to say so.

>>>>>Quoting the 9/11 commission and Clint Eastwood is just plain weak. ... you don't need to include your lame-ass opinion on whether you think he did a good job.

That was someone else's post. Not Walter's.

>>>>> But, like I said, you would probably NEVER have the guts to say what you said TO someone's face.

He pretty much just did.

May I first say to Theloneous, glad you made it back and are recovering. Thank you for the courage to tell your story.

Second to Thinair, you accurately captured the essence of solo hiking and the rewards it offers to those willing to invest in that unique experience.

I have solo hiked about 6 times over the past 15 years and have had both good and bad experiences. I once thought I would freeze to death on a snowshoe excursion into Bridalveil Campground in February but was rewarded with magnificent views and memories of the west face of the Tetons along the Teton Crest Trail one August. On all my solo efforts I thought in the beginning I was well prepared and willing to face any challenges thrown my way. I started a Southbound effort of the JMT in 2003 only to stop 3 days in after experiencing some of the worst three days of Sierra storms. I have a good feel for my limitations.

I am sure hubris was part of what motivated me each time to engage in these adventures as well as every time I wander away from pavement. What strikes me reading this string of messages and Theloneous’ original posting is the lack of recognition by most of the respondents of their own motivations. Hubris drives all of who venture past the safety of our fabricated world.

I read with interest the SAR report and was shocked and impressed to see that Theloneous is 63 years old. I am assuming this was not the first time he had strapped on a pair of boots or downed an energy bar. I feeel certain he has evaluated his own limitations prior to this most recent trip.

I am also reminded that in every great tragedy there are stories of people who risked more rescuing someone than the person injured. Every time we strike out on a new adventure, we call upon a wealth of personal traits and human emotions to motivate us. If you have not examined your own strengths and weaknesses, you have been irresponsible to those you may call upon in your time of need.

Belittle Theloneous if you will but think about this, “ Egotism is the one thing nobody will forgive in others, and which everybody forgives in himself.”

Ted,

Please don't take this the wrong way, but I have a couple of questions (I'm kinda curious) for you, and a general comment to the board readers:

Is Inyo planning on billing you for the rescue?

Are you planning on sueing over the delay caused by the jurisdictional issue?

Although some people would disagree, I don't understand why people use the Main Trail to attempt the summit under "winter" conditions. The Mountaineer's Route is much shorter, with only slightly more "technical" difficulty. If you don't have the skills necessary, or haven't been up there previously, don't go solo! (I've been up there plenty of times by myself, but on multi-day trips, if I don't hook up with someone, or at least let them know that I am there, I bail.)

There are plenty of us who like to have company (I doubt that there are many of us who prefer to climb solo - it's just a convenience thing.), and are willing to give a few pointers, so it isn't that difficult to find a climbing partner.

(I know, it's more a lecture than a comment, so go ahead and flame me!)

alone or with friends during winter

thou shall not get separated from sleeping bag!

thou shall not get separated from shelter!

thou shall not get separated from stove!

Amen

I can see that the "lessons learned" from my incident were not very clear to some of the readers of my written account, so let me be more specific:

1) This was NOT a case of too much reliance on technology, if anything it was just the opposite; maybe I should have been more up-to-date and aware of later technology. I carry an ancient Magellan Blazer 12 as a BACKUP device. I did not even turn it on until my problems started, same with my cell phone.
2) Those of you who are so proud of your "cross country" navigation have learned nothing from this account! My point was that there are weather conditions that can come on quickly and can result in conditions so difficult that even Nathanial Bowditch would not be able to navigate them. So... even if it's a mere 2 mile side trip, be prepared to "hunker down" and wait out a storm, one which may last for several days.
3) My minimum survival gear is and always has been (except when overconfidence overcame good sense in this incident): space blanket/poncho, candle lantern and matches/lighter, headlamp/flashlight.

Theloneus

Theloneus responds to
Richard Piotrowski

"Is Inyo planning on billing you for the rescue?"

Theloneus responds:
They have not indicated that they will. In any case, the evacuation was by a Highway Patrol unit from Paso Robles. I presume they do not charge for that any more than they do when they respond to a highway incident. If you find that subject interesting, a couple of years ago a friend of mine did a study for the NPS to help decide if they should charge fore rescues from Denali. They concluded that they should not. I don't have the study but go to crevasse.com and Mike will help you to find it.

"Are you planning on sueing over the delay caused by the jurisdictional issue?"

Theloneus responds:
No, those delays were annoying but not critical to my survival. Perhaps if the delay had extended for another night my estate would have considered it.

"I don't understand why people use the Main Trail to attempt the summit under "winter" conditions. The Mountaineer's Route is much shorter, with only slightly more "technical" difficulty. If you don't have the skills necessary, or haven't been up there previously, don't go solo!"

Theloneus responds:
1) I went up the chute. The dificulty was not in getting to the summit in winter conditions, I did that with no problem. The problem was being stranded in whiteout conditions. Surely you aren't suggesting that under those conditions it would have been easier to descend the Mountaineer's route than the traverse trail to the Crest?
2) I've been there twice before, and passed by once in a High Sierra Trail trip; I'm not convinced that going solo, in this case, had anything to do with the outcome -- see previous posts for more on that subject.

RP -- For futher correspondence on this feel free to contact me by e-mail

Thelonious,
You said that if you had spent another night out and I am assuming you meant died, your estate may have considered a law suit? That just blows my mind! Why is someone else responsible for your well being and safety, especialy in the winter and going solo. So do the many who are left dead on the flanks of mountains around the world have the right to sue if there adventure did not turn out the way they planned? What is adventure? Some of the best trips in my life are what I would call epic. Being caught unexpetedly overnight on a river while kayaking and spending the night freezing and hungry or an unplanned bivy on the east face of Whitney with no water and puking my guts out. These are just a few of the stupid situations I have gotten myself into but have learned the most from. Dont blame anyone else for delayed rescue but yourself, you are the one who decided to put yourself in that situation in the first place.