Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board Hiker vs. Hunters during deer season

Hey Everyone,

I am having an interesting discussion in another thread and decided to just ask outright... What does everyone think about hikers and high powered rifel hunters being in the same area for the next two weeks..? I think there should be some way to balance the two..What does everyone think,..?

Thanks,

Tidbit

I would not choose to hike in an area in which rifle hunting is allowed. I would not have the same problem with areas in which shotgun or bow hunting is allowed.

I think that hunting areas and hunting seasons should be well-publicized so that hikers and others can make sensible choices.

If hunting is allowed in a National Forest, I think that hunting information shoule be prominent on the National Forest Web site.

Hikers vs Hunters? In that case they should arm the hikers too, just to make it even. Some kevlar would help, and maybe AK47 vending machines at the trailheads. And how about pill boxes at campsites. Yeah, that sounds good. Peace.

Considering that hunters do shoot their hunting partners on occasion, hikers in areas where hunting is under way should be aware of the situation and think about wearing a bright orange vest and hat. A statistic that I have is read is that most deer are shot within 200 feet of a paved or dirt road. Not many hunters travel deep into the backcountry. The hunting zones and seasons can be found on the Dept. of Fish and Game web site http://www.dfg.ca.gov/

Hey,

We are going to be hunting up tworkds Kearsarge pass. From what i heard, there might be many hikers and BP's this weekend. I am a very responsible hunter as are 99.99% of other hunters, but that said, a 30-.06 bullet travels a heck of a long ways... I think the idea of requireing all hikers and BP's to wear orange vests is a VERY good idea. Maybe we could actually submit this to the NFS..?

Thanks,

Tidbit

BOb K.

No one is arming the hunters, we purchase our own weapons, and jump through many hoops to enjoy this time of year. Yuo too could carry a weapon if you have the necessary permits, but since you haven't, we will have the protection from bears, and you will just be lower on the food chain than they are..

Peace,

Tidbit

I asked this in the other thread, and got no answer, which makes me think this is just a troll. (what is the troll season, I have my permit!)

I asked, why would a hunter go to an area where they knew that there were a lot of people keeping the deer wary?

There is a heck of a lot of terrain where this is not the case, on the eastside. One won't be hiking in with a rifle 5 miles, you got to carry it out! Hogsback creek, George Creek, Bair's Creek (N&S), all great areas, all with easy access, all with no hikers.
Seems odd to me.

I just got back from climbing in a area during bow season. Saw lots of hunters. It made me a little leery hiking at night. My only concern is that while hunting they are not drinking alcohol or have not drank it for some time prior to hunting. I have heard of many hunters being shot but very few hikers in comparison. I think it is more dangerous driving to work in the morning than hiking with hunters.

BTW, I am not a hunter.

TB, If it's dangerous for hikers to be in an area where hunters have a legal right to shoot, then hikers shouldn't be there. And the case you talked about where a 30-06 bullet misses the target and goes far past the mark, a bright orange jacket wouldn't help because the hunter isn't looking there. I think it's imprudent, to say the least, for a hiker to be in a place where a hunter could mistake him for a deer, assuming the hunter has a legal right to be there. This is especially true for hikers who want to exercise their constitutional right to wear antlers.

Oh, and add to my list in my previous message, hikers should be allowed to call in airstrikes by F-18A's. Who knows, they might be good for deer hunting too. Nothing like a well placed napalm drop to not only kill the animal but cook it too.

Seriously, I wouldn't have the heart to kill a deer for sport. Well..... except maybe for that one that gave me a dirty look. Yeah, I could tell that he was just waiting for the chance to stick his antlers into my liver. In fact, the voices said he was going to do that and they never lie.

"I think it's imprudent for a hiker to be in a place where a hunter could mistake him for a deer."

I humbly disagree. Allow me to change this sentence to:

"I think it's imprudent for a hunter to be in a place he could mistake a hiker for a deer."

This is from a few years back (2000), but gives you a good idea about how California deer hunting accidents actually happen:

http://www.dfg.ca.gov/huntered/accident/ca2000.html

Nutshell:

4 rifle injuries
2 rifle ricochet injuries
1 rifle fatality (self-inflicted)

Out of 4 rifle injuries, 2 were ricochets and 1 was self-inflicted. Wearing orange might have helped in only one of those cases--might. Requiring that all hikers wear orange seems overreaching, but informing hikers that it might make them more visible to hunters seems very reasonable.

The other notable stats on the ca.gov link suggest that hunters with shotguns targeting birds are the most likely to get injured and that bowhunters had zero accidents in 2000.

Ken,

I apologize for not directly answering your question about gonig into an area where the deer might be wary of people. There are so many people in the sierreas o that the deer get used to seeing foot traffic. The deer, especially big bucks are in the highcountry. I have been told that we will have to be going into more inaccesable areas. Into the"nasty stuff" they call it. We very well maybe going to the Taboose creek area instead, just haven't decided yet...

Thanks,

Tim

During hunting season, hunters have as much right as hikers to be in the backcountry. And like it or not, outside of hunting season, hikers probably play a large role in getting deer used to people - thus making them easier targets.

Another aspect of deer hunting: I can never figure out the published numbers regarding the mountain lion population. If there are conservatively a thousand mountain lions in California, and they each kill 1 - 2 deer per week, that's 50 - 100 THOUSAND bambis transformed into lion chow each year. Yet there appear to be a lot of deer in the Sierra.

Anyone know how many are taken by hunters?

Tidbit..Im curious as to why you feel you need protection from the bears?

I do not think hikers and backpackers should be required to where a bright orange vest...and if that ever happens I will for sure be writing letters voicing my opinion!!

It's the ones that carry guns that I feel I need protection from, not the wildlife.
Like I said in your other post..I do think the Forest service should post on the TH signs to warn people that it is hunting season & let them know when they pick up there permit...having a sign posted at the front door would be good too.
I do not think hikers and backpackers mix well with hunters shooting off guns....the hikers and backpackers I know go for the quietness and peace you get while out there. Hiking up a beautiful trail and hearing the sounds of gun fire is not what I would want to hear..I did experience this years ago and I will never forget the sounds echoing, for me it was a horrible experience & I hope I never have to hear that again

You don't need a gun to protect yourself from bears. Just stay in shape. It works like this:

Hiker 1: "What will you do if a bear attacks?"
Hiker 2: "Run like hell."
Hiker 1: "Do you really think you can outrun a bear?"
Hiker 2: "No. All I have to do is outrun you."

:-)

Let's have equal respect for both hikers and hunters. Be tolerant. After all we have a common interest in loving the outdoors. I do like to wear bright colors when I hike, usually orange, red, or yellow. This makes it more visible to hunters but also SAR groups in case you get hurt or lost. On a side note, back in June I climbed Cummings mountain here in Kern county, ( best summit view of any Kern peak, I swear it is ) the peak was on private property and in this case I made it a goal to get permission from the ranch manager to hike there. He politely granted me permission to hike on two certain days since there would be hunters on the property on the other days of the week since the ranch also doubled as a game preserve/hunt club.

Rafael...

Madeintahoe,
You may not be required to wear orange and I think even more importantly, a headlamp in low light conditions, but if you plan to go hiking during the hunting season, it just makes good sense.

Go look at the link supplied by InYoFace. 11 people were accidentally shot in 2000. Zero were wearing blaze orange vests.

You have a right to hike. Hunters have a right to hunt.

It's kind of like you have a right to ride your bike at night. But that dosen't mean the cars will see you if you don't wear bright clothing and use proper lights.

From the INF website under "Current Conditions"
http://www.fs.fed.us/r5/inyo/conditions/south_report.htm

Trails

Trails above approximately 12,500 ft have patchy snow and ice. Overnight temperatures have been at or slightly below freezing. Be prepared for changing weather conditions by bringing appropriate gear and warm clothing. Hikers should be aware that archery hunting season for deer and upland game birds is open for many locations in the Sierra Nevada (except National Parks). In areas open to hunting, wear brightly colored clothes and stay on the trails.

Hunting

Hunting season for Dove opened September 1st. Archery season for quail, chukar and Blue/Ruffed grouse is open in the Eastern Sierra. Archery season for bucks is open in zones X-8, X-9a/b/c, X-12 (primarily Alpine, Mono and Inyo Counties) and X-10 (the Kern Plateau). Archery season for deer, on the west side of the Sierra Nevada is open in zones D-6, D-7 (west and south of Yosemite National Park) and D-8, D-9 (south and southwest of Sequoia/Kings Canyon National Parks). Hunters should keep in mind that many people use these areas for other types of sports; and should avoid hunting near developed sites, roads and trails. Hunting is not permitted in National Parks.

This is probably way too simple but maybe the guys with the guns just need to be sure what they are shooting is, in fact, a deer, and not a hiker.

I don't have a problem with hunters in the national forest. I bet if you were to really look at the hunting accident statistics, very few were in the real back country. I think most hunters who go through the trouble of hiking deep into the backcountry are a little better prepared phyically and mentally, and probably don't carry a case of beer with them, either. Likewise with the horsepackers.

I have also been hiking in areas that were easily accessible from roads by hiking less than an hour, and I was a little more concerned there after running across several hunters. Maybe in those circumstances a blaze orange hat or shirt would be a good idea. But when you look at how many non-hunters have been the victims of hunting accidents, compared to the total number of non-hunters in the woods, you probably have a higher probability of being eaten by a mountain lion.

Regarding success statistics, the Fresno Bee published some numbers today. For zones D7 and D8, the 2005 success rate was about 4% of the approximately 16,000 tags issued there.

Hunters should be glad that backpackers get deer used to human presence. I have had many encounters with deer in the sierra where they did not seem very concerned with my presence. When I was growing up in upstate NY, I would wander around in the hills where there wasn't any real human presence except during deer season, and the deer wouldn't let you get anywhere near them. Maybe whitetails are more wary, but I think acclimation to people is also part of the reason.