Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board How to feel when you are not there

My son Andrew

http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2385540200061435028ohzZSW

called this morning at 4:30 am. He said "hi, this is Andrew" and then the cell phone cut out. I was left to wonder just where he was and guessed he was at Lower Boy Scout Lake. You know how you feel you feel when you get to Lower Boy Scout Lake....good.

An hour latter he called from up around Upper Boy Scout Lake. He is guiding some friends of mine up the Mountaineers Route today. He said they are doing well and making progress....Have I trained him well enough...I hope so.

It is a difficult thing for me, having my twin boys (13 years old) hiking near Log Cabin Scout camp on the eastern edge of Yosemite....and having Andrew on his first big hike without me.

But I will try to get over it, celebrating my 24th Anniversary today and tomorrow in San Diego....just chilling.

> Have I trained him well enough...

...not if he calls you at 4:30 AM just to say hi!

On the other hand, it makes you proud to know that you have passed on the love of the mountains to your children.

Congratulations on the anniversary. Now chill and have fun!

Kent:

Spoken like a true parent, agonizing over watching the kids grow up. How proud you must be of them, and of yourself for definitely having 'trained them well enough'.

It makes me wonder what my folks are thinking whenever I go out on one of my adventures. While they instilled a deep love of the outdoors, I don't think they ever dreamed I would take it to this level (or beyond). They've told me the do appreciate the call on Sunday night when I get home, though...

Can't wait to hear how he does today with your friends! (I'm sure you also trained him to take the camera along, no??)

-L

So..............I got the run down from the hike last night late. If I had known what was happening on the Mountaineers Route I would have been more concerned for sure.

1) Although the group my son Andrew was leading got an OK start and made good progress up to about Upper Boy Scout Lake.......the group slowed way down after that... (mostly the effect of fatigue and altitude). This delay led them into the afternoon thunderstorm on the summit.

2) One member of the group had a shoe come apart just above Iceberg Lake and had to retreat to Iceberg Lake and wait. The usual problem....trying to keep the shoe together long enough to get back to the car...with shoe laces and a little duct tape.

3) They hiked right into the afternoon Thunderstorm..with hail and rain on the summit.

4) They had to climb back down the staircase to the notch on slippery snow/ hail covered rock. Very scary and dangerous with members of the group slipping here and there. And of course everyone was wet and cold.

5) And my favorite......."listening to lightning and thunder off in the distance"......When on the summit Andrew saw the hair of two other climbers go from normal to standing straight up....a sure sign of dangerous electrical storm.

6) On the way down, just a little below the notch in the MR....a lightning bolt hike so close it lit the whole canyon up and forced them to hit the deck and duck for cover....including a huge explosion of sound that rumbled all the way down the Mountaineers route. And did I mention....there was no delay between the light and the sound....they came together.

I think both of us feel very fortunate this trip didn't result in someone getting hurt..or worse.

If was 24 hours between the time they started hiking and when they finally got back home in Los Angeles.....about 2 a.m.

I will post some pictures tonight.

Kent -- It appears that Andrew faced the question some of us were discussing a year ago. Is it better to sit out an electrical storm in the Hut or descend as rapidly as possible? The MR got mentioned as a nice way to lose elevation rapidly, but no one mentioned the added fun (i.e., danger) of slippery rock.

Not that I'm recommending re-starting that debate!

One thing that is probably worth thinking about: Hitting the deck is not a great idea in a lightning storm. I believe that more injuries occur due to currents flowing in the Earth than from direct strikes in which the person is part of the path to ground. If you are spread out on the ground and a strike occurs nearby, you are maximizing the chances that you will provide a lower resistance current path, which means very bad things for you! It's best to have only your feet, which should be together, in contact with the ground. There is lots more advice out there about where to crouch, etc. Basically, if you're outside and lightning is striking nearby, you are playing Russian Roulette.

I bet they hit the deck out of sheer terror or fear. It would be a natural reaction to a lightning strike nearby, even though it would not necessarily be the safest thing to do. I can't imagine someone seeing a lightning strike up close and not reacting that way.

But then again, I have not yet had that experience. So I don't know if I would even have the mental clarity to know how to react.

I agree. I would probably have reacted that way until a couple of years ago. After several people were killed in Sandy Meadow in 2005, I decided it was time to do some reading. I am not an expert and hesitate to give advice but, if I had just had a "lightning adventure" I would appreciate some input on what I did right or wrong.

By the way, I think it's great that the younger generation of Ashcrafts is taking over from Kent the chore of putting together and leading outings. I am going through a similar experience myself. For that reason, I sympathize with Kent regarding what it feels like to be back at home while the young ones are out.

Don't have my own kids (and about the only time I regretted it was when I read and saw the photos from Ashcraft outings), but I'd think you guys would be happy to not have to huff-and-puff after the young ones anymore.

I sure had me fill standing in for my B-I-L a couple of weekends ago.:)

You raise a good point. I should have thought of that before last week. Instead of chasing youth I could take up golf.

On second thought...

Come to think of it, I think this is the first time one of Kent's children has gone to Mt. Whitney without him.

If I count correctly, this is Andrew's third Mt. Whitney summit of the summer and his 6th summit overall. They made of big deal of his 1st one day summit last month, so this would be his 2nd one day.

Not bad for a 17 year old.

Going back....you are correct about Andrew and myself. A few years ago I couldn't ever have imagined he would be ready to take someone up the Mountaineers route to Mt. Whitney. He has really grown up a lot and gained some real confidence hiking.

I asked Andrew about the duck and cover move. He said they didn't lay down or anything.....just crouched down and leaned toward the wall for any cover...to be away from the open. He confirmed there was a whoosh as the lightning hit with a huge boom ...all at the same time. James Hepworth told me the strike was probably up around the notch and they were about 500 feet down in the colour. It was a very scary thing for all of them.

None of them would want to be anywhere near the summit during a thunderstorm again.

I also experienced the storm on the 5th. I left the tarn above Guitar Lake at 5:30 am and could already see clouds forming. It was obvious, to me, that something was brewing when I made the summit at 8:40 am. I only stayed 20 minutes due to the clouds coming in. I even commented on them to several people who assured me that nothing was in the works. My gut told me otherwise, and since I knew I had a long ways to go, I wanted to be as low as possible if anything hit. I was amazed at the number of people who were continuing to go up as I came down the switchbacks. I made it to Outpost Camp before the storm hit me. There were many people up higher that I did not envy.
Andrew has more experience than I ever will be able to obtain, but I spent one horrific afternoon and evening at Trail Camp a few years ago that gave me a healthy fear of clouds in the Sierras. It is easy for me to sit at home and second guess, but why did he continue his ascent when it was obvious a storm was coming in?
Brian

Good question: They left early at 2:00 am to have time to get to the summit and and off before the afternoon thunderstorms that were in the weather forecast were expected to show up....but the pace slowed down enough they ended up at the summit just before the afternoon thunderstorm really got going.

Andrew's response is along these lines.

Andrew's #1 goal was to get the group to the summit. He was willing to continue as long as they were willing to keep going. The clouds were getting darker but there was also some blue sky when they were coming up on the notch

http://outdoors.webshots.com/photo/2048781860061435028DgjZOE

There was no rain until they got up to the summit ridge and then it began to rain. The couple's hair started standing up about 5 minutes later. By that time it was beginning to hail. Within about ten minutes the thunder started up.

He also said that although he had heard me talk about afternoon thunderstorms (and I had discussed their danger with the other adults that were going) he had not experienced them himself.

The thunder began far away and started moving closer. They decided they needed to get off the summit ASAP. By the time they got back into the staircase the thunder and lighting was getting much closer.

I have started from Iceberg Lake with clear skies and arrived at the summit in light rain. It just happens. I don't know if I would have turned around either.....until I heard lightning and thunder in the distance. It is hard to be that close and turn around.