Mt. Whitney Portal Store & Hostel Forums General Mt. Whitney Portal Store Message Board May/June Conditions on the Main Whitney Trail

Advice Sought for First Timers

As a middle aged guy who will be attempting this stroll for a first time, I appreciate the advice and guidance offered so generously by those of you who know the mountain so well.

Three of us (2 others around 40) are experienced backpackers, comfortable with altitude, but two (including yours truly) with no previous adventures climbing in the snow. We had originally planned to acclimate on Sunday night in Whitney Portal, spend Monday night at Trail Camp, and return to Whitney Portal either Tuesday evening or Wednesday AM (possible stop at Outpost Camp) if it is late or we are really exhausted. Our actual permit will be issued on Sunday and were told that we must start up the mountain that day.

I have avidly read this thread for a while and have a few questions:

1. What are best suggested camping areas a mile or two from the trailhead? We will be probably be getting started around noon on Sunday, 6/21. Where would be a good place to stop?

2. What time to start on Monday? If we follow thru on plan to stay at Trail Camp and summit the next day, how early should we get going? 5AM? 6AM ? Earlier?
Crampons and ice axes have been rented, but it appears that they may not be necessary on the main trail, at least up to TC

3. Suggested Rope - what kind do you recommend; how long?


All guidance and suggestions truly welcomed. While we have every intention of reaching the summit, you collective wisdom has made great impact - caution and a healthy dose of reality will prevail.

Many thanx

I agree those were great photo's myself and 3 friends will be climbing on the 26th, we are all hoping for sun but either way we will be prepared

Scooga... what day is your "entry date"? You should be able to pick your permit up the day -before- your entry date (if your reservation is for Sunday 06-21-09 you should be able to pick it up Saturday 06-20-09). Double check those dates and it should take some pressure off of your time schedule for hiking on Sunday... freeing up more of your time and allowing you an earlier start.

SoCal Girl -

Thanx for prompt reply. Our permit is for Sunday and we probably will not arrive in the area until Sunday morning sometime. Snow rental stuff not available until Sunday AM in Bishop.

No real pressure, just a slight change in plans.

This is an easy question, IMHO. Lone Pine Lake. It's about a two mile hike, and if you are leaving around noon, you'll have plenty of time to make it there. The last time I was there, there were only two other campers on the entire lake. It was quiet, serene, and I awoke to a sunrise over a placid surface of water. Beats staying at the Portal.


Will take you about three hrs from LPL to Trail Camp, with a gradual pace and the obligatory stop at Trailside Meadow. There's no need to wake up really early.



On the MMWT, there's no need for any climbing rope.

Peter:

The conventional wisdom is that people should not climb steep snow without crampons, ice axe, stiff mountaineering boots, and proper training. Nobody is suggesting that people should attempt Mt. Whitney without crampons and ice axe because they don't know how to use them. We are saying that no one should attempt Whitney at all until they know what they are doing.

It sounds like you did your homework, practiced until you knew what you were doing, and then summitted successfully. I don't think you did anything stupid or dangerous.

While it appears that you have the intelligence, athletic ability, and motivation to teach yourself how to use crampons and ice axe at Trail Camp before heading up the chute, not all climbers will do this. Far too many people who have no clue how to cope with snow, ice, high altitude, cold, and exhaustion attempt Whitney every year. Some of them get into trouble, and occasionally, someone dies. My original point is that some of your remarks make it a little easier for them to justify doing things that could get them into trouble.

Bob

These are all great questions - thanks for posting them - i'm a first timer too. Looks like you and I may overlap - we have a day permit for monday.

Which brings me to my own question - if we get to portal on saturday and find out there are spots for sunday, are we able to do an overnight on the trail (ie hike sun/mon instead of just monday)? If so, this would change our food/gear packing so would be helpful to know ahead of time. But would prob make for a better acclimatizing...

Second question - i was misinformed that we couldn't reserve a spot at portal ahead of time (turns out you can but now its outside the reservation window). Does anyone know how late we can get a walk-in spot (there will be 6 of us)?

Thanks again!!

I wanted to edit my prior post to add one point, but it is so far back no one would find it.

Bob Pickering's comment about taking newbies' recommendations with some skepticism is a good one. A newbie may have some valid points based on the conditions when he was there, but he does not have the breadth of experience to know what the conditions might be at other times. One snapshot does not an expert make.

As is pretty clear from the last few weeks, the conditions can go from benign to pretty serious from one part of the day to another, and certainly from one day to the next.

A newbie has only one piece of data. Some minimal training that might have proved sufficient for his climb, could have been sorely lacking if he had encountered icy conditions instead. And, as I have said before, no one should take any advice from someone--newbie or otherwise--who experienced certain conditions, and assume that they will be the same a day or more later.

Thankfully, everyone seems to have this down pat: Be as prepared as you can, but always be ready to turn back if your skills, preparations, or gear are not up to it when you get there.

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With regard to the questions about "current" conditions: I summited via the main trail yesterday, and will post a report and pictures later. But I will mention here the young man I observed glissading from Trail Crest, with crampons; I talked to him afterward. The snow was pretty soft, so he was waving his ax around and whooping the whole way. When he speeded up, he dragged the adze to slow him. If he had gone out of control, he was going to stick the spike in the snow, and simultaneously dig his crampons in to stop. He had no idea how to self arrest properly. When I told him what a dangerous thing he had just done, he said he wouldn't have attempted it without crampons.

How much instruction do you think this young man got, prior to being in a situation where it might have been life-saving? I didn't ask him, but it is clear to me his ice ax was either rented or borrowed. I gave him a five-minute tutorial, but he just blew it off.

Wanderlust - My understanding is that there are around 10 spots still open for Sunday entry. I believe you can switch your Monday permit for a sunday "entry" without penalty or problem. Just check at the Permit office in Lone Pine. I suspect this will free up your Monday permits for someone else.

How will we recognize you? We are a threesome - Older guy (me) with salt and pepper hair (mostly salt, such as remains) with a couple of younger folks.

Regards,

Scoogas

Hey Scooga,

I meant more whether we could convert it into an overnight... but i just realized one of our party is meeting us on sunday, so i guess its a moot point. Oh well.

Where are you camping outside of the permit? We're shooting for Whitney portal ourselves (unfortunately not reserved as we got info that you couldnt reserve...).

We're a party of five - 3 guys and 2 girls in our early/mid 30s. Hope to see you... and the peak .

Hello again wanderlust

Because there are overnight slots available, you probably can convert if you so desire.

I believe the backpackers campground does not take, nor need reservations. You might try that. We (2 guys, one lady) are arriving sunday and will be spending a couple of nights on the mountain.

Hope to see you and your gang when we plan to summit on Tuesday AM.

Scooga

My friends and I have contemplated whether our experiance (very little) should qualify us to consider the summit on 6/26/2009. I have never climbed in snow, and after reading everyone's disagreements on what tools to use or not use, I'm thinking maybe we should not attempt the summit. We are all comfortable with that decision.

My question is, can our trip be saved? How far up can we get without the need of these tools.

Newb,
Your trip can not only be saved- but thoroughly enjoyed! Make up your mind before going that you will enjoy the hike no matter how high you go- and you won't be let down when you get there.

Make your decision on whether or not to attempt summit the day you go- looking at the conditions and all the factors then. It's quite a haul and accomplishment just to make it up to where the snow starts.

If it stays warm, plenty of snow will prob melt and there will likely be a path trudged thru and/or over the snow that will be usable. Use your head- don't be caught off guard- You're wise not to attempt if you're not comfortable- there will always be another day you can go with less snow. Have a plan or at least an idea of what to do also if some of your group want to try, and some don't. There could be a storm that turns you around before you even get to snow- you never know? If you don't make summit... you'll be stoked to come back and make it again someday.

I'm starting to get excited now too as I'll be up on July 2! Hopefully I'll summit but the journey will be a fantastic day trip either way I'm sure ~

And yeah- if I don't make it I'll prob take your governor's advice and do as your guv would say... "I'll be back"

Newb, no matter how high you are able to get, the adventure of doing Whitney can always be used as a learning/training experience. I also have no snow experience at this altitude, but for next year I'm planning on getting crampons & ice axe, along with some training in their use. I'll be going up on June 27, so even if we don't make the peak I'm sure we'll learn alot for next time. Good luck.

My daughter and I made it to trail camp twice last summer. On our second trip we actually made it to the cables. I don't consider either of our trips a failure. The hike and the experience are wonderful. You don't need to "save" your trip, you need to savor it! Each step brings so many new views and if you make the summit (this time) it just adds icing on the cake! Enjoy your trip, take it as far as you can and be safe.

I just got back from doing a day trek on the mt. We left the trail head at 0300 hrs and were at trail camp at 0800 hrs. All of the water that was on the trail above trail side meadow was frozen all the way up onto the switch backs. I had been reading all of the previous posts regarding the use of crampons and an ice ax and decided to go up with out because I had never used them and this was not the place to do a test run. We headed up to the cable section saying to ourselves if it gets sketchy we will turn around. We tried to cross using others tracks but the snow was way to icy. In a nut shell if you are going up within the next several days you will need crampons and an ice ax. The snow is melting fast but it freezes at night and does not start to thaw until after 0900 hrs. This is my two cents. you can take it or leave it. but those that had the tools made it. The others that didn't turned around . Sure was it diapointing..yes but the mt is not going anywhere and the snow is.

Just got back from a MR-MT loop.

Conditions on the MR varied. The chute to the notch had some wonderful kick steps already in the snow - made for easy going. The final 400 was snow and some ice sections requiring crampons and ice axe usage. This was the only time we used the crampons all day.

Went down the main trail. Lots of folks using crampons all the way to the summit. The snow is good condition so we did not put ours on. There is a good boot path and I expect the snow along the trail from the JMT junction to be mostly gone within the next few days. At the cable there is one ice section. Bob R.'s conditions report was accurate and we were pleased. We did not need crampons. We did use our axe for support but felt that trecking poles might have sufficed. For those not comfortable with these type conditions, crampons and axe should still be used. Above the cables the trail is clearing fast. Conditions should change over the next week or so as the snow melts out.



rest of pictures

We leave this Wednesday out of Horsehoe Meadows, Cottonwood Pass to Crabtree Meadow. Our plans have us going up the JMT on the west side, summitting and coming back down the main trail to the Portal next Sunday, July 26.

Question for anyone who was up on the summit last weekend? Is the JMT up the west side to trail crest clear of snow yet? Given the projected warming trend this week, do you think that the main trail will be clear enough by next weekend that most people will be doing the main trail without crampons (including cable section)?

I understand usual caveats apply (e.g. unpredictable weather, be prepared for anything, depends on level of expereince etc.)


Thanks

Hi H ofT.
We just got back off the Main trail yesterday.

We used crampons (very briefly in a few spots) and trekking poles the whole way and made the peak without too much trouble. We had ice axes but didn't feel the need to use them. The only areas with lots of snow that may not melt too soon (even with the warm sunny weather) are likely to be the cables and perhaps the final traverse up to trail crest. In both areas the snow is still plentiful, very packed down, and at the cables there is a lot of shade much of the day and there is a patch of fairly solid ice about 5 feet long that is kind of worrisome. Nonetheless, a fair number of the summiters we saw (about 30+ in total) did not have crampons nor much equipment other than the shirts on their backs..... Thus, I think it is quite likely that most people won't be using crampons on the MWMT next week but safety is still somewhat questionable in a few spots.

We also hiked for a day over in the Horsheshoe meadows area and found very little snow there up to about 11,500 ft.

Enjoy it! It sure is beautiful up there. Wish we didn't have to leave,
Andrew

Thanks for the update. We are heading up via Cottonwood on Sunday with a projected summit on the 3rd. We will not have crampons or ice axes, so it seems we should be ok if the weather holds.

Ryan